Rebecca Kase: Episode LInk

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On this episode, we discuss discusses the importance of neurophysiological fitness in handling EMDR therapy. It highlights that individuals who prioritize self-care and wellness are more likely to have the capacity to handle the challenges of EMDR. On the other hand, individuals who do not prioritize self-care may need to work on improving their overall well-being before undergoing EMDR. The duration of EMDR therapy varies depending on the individual’s level of dysregulation. Some may see results in a few weeks or months, while others with chronic dysregulation may require several months or even a couple of years to train their nervous system to handle the therapy.

TRANSCRIPT:

Welcome back to Hot Flashes and Cold Topics podcast, everybody. Today, we have Rebecca Case on, and Rebecca Case is an EMDR consultant and a trainer,
and she also is the owner of Case and Company. So we’re really thrilled to have her here today because anything that women in our demographic can do. to help during this time of life when we are just experiencing stress or any menopause or perimenopausal symptoms,
we love to have options out there. And so we’re really excited to have Rebecca here today to talk with us about these options. So welcome to the show. Thank you. I am thrilled to be here.
Such an important topic that doesn’t get talked about enough. Yeah, it is. And you know, women are really looking for options out there whether it’s something medical you know something that they can take orally or something on their body or something that they can do with their body to help with the situation we are always thrilled that they have the options out there.
So one of the first things could you just share with us what EMDR therapy is? Yeah EMDR stands for Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing.
It’s a really long name, so we just call it EMDR. It is an evidence -based therapy for the treatment of PTSD and trauma. It’s evidence -based, meaning there’s a whole bunch of research that supports it.
It’s recognized around the world, by the World Health Organization, the APA, the Department of Veterans Affairs. So it is a solid therapeutic approach that is not moving.
-woo or controversial. It’s very effective for trauma, for PTSD, and for a lot of other common things that can show up when we have unresolved trauma or just a lot of stress in our life,
like addictions and low self -esteem and depression and anxiety and panic and obsessive and compulsive thinking. So EMDR therapy involves eight phases of treatment,
so it’s not just an intervention, it’s a whole kind of therapeutic protocol that starts with really building a safe and supportive relationship, to then helping you learn skills to be more equipped to self -soothe and regulate times of stress and overwhelm in your nervous system.
And then kind of the key piece of EMDR that most people think of when they think of EMDR therapy is phases where we… focus on disturbing or adverse experiences that have gotten stuck and are causing yuck in your neurobiology.
So that might be that time that you were in middle school and you got mocked and ridiculed by a mean teacher. It could be a combat trauma memory. It could be like a really yucky argument that you had with your partner.
So it doesn’t have to be like this huge traumatic event necessarily. And so in EMDR therapy, believe that some of those really stressful events are above and beyond our nervous system’s ability to kind of digest or metabolize.
So they get kind of stuck in our neurobiology and our nervous system continues to react to those experiences through triggers or activators. And so when something all of a sudden reminds you of that time that you were in middle school being ridiculed by a mean teacher,
whether you are consciously aware of it or not, your nervous system starts responding in a similar way. Maybe you feel like really angry or really anxious or you feel shut down and like you’re not good enough. So EMDR uses something called bilateral stimulation,
which can be eye movements or tapping or even bilateral tones that beat back and forth in the ears. And while you focus on that yucky memory that you and your therapist will kind of excavate and uncover.
what those experiences are, you think about that memory, you feel all the yuck that goes along with it. You notice the bilateral stimulation and it’s amazing what the effects that has on your nervous system,
it really allows your nervous system to process that memory so that then when you think about it, you’re like, huh, that’s a really mean teacher. But, you know, I’m okay.
That wasn’t about me. They shouldn’t have been teaching. and you feel resolved about it. So there’s a lot of science behind it and why bilateral stimulation works, how it works. I know it sounds really strange and controversial at first,
but it really does work with your neurobiology and how your nervous system processes information. So if I’m understanding you correctly, a patient will come in with some prior trauma.
and as they are thinking about the trauma or talking about the trauma, you will do something that kind of realigns their thought process with the trauma,
whether it’s, you know, finger movements or tapping or whichever. And that somehow reimagines the trauma inside their body so they don’t react with the same anxiety or depression.
No! am I correct with that? And two, how long does that take? – Yeah, so close. So first off, people often don’t come to therapy and say like,
I have unresolved trauma that I need to heal. Like sometimes they do, you know, sometimes it’s like, I’ve been through a sexual assault or I’m a combat veteran, but those are what are considered to be big T traumas.
Things that like you and I can easily say like, that was traumatic. But what people more often come to therapy for is what we call little T traumas. The things that don’t feel so acute and maybe aren’t imminent threats to your life.
So like being bullied, being in an emotionally abusive relationship, you know, growing up with just parents who weren’t very nurturing or loving. And so those are things that we usually can’t easily pinpoint and say I feel like this because of all of that.
What we know is like I feel terrible. I’m struggling with anxiety and you know I chronically and beating myself up inside and I can’t sleep and I feel you know so insecure about myself my relationships are a mess.
And so people usually come in saying like I am suffering I am miserable I am. messy inside. And so the EMDR therapist is aware that you’re not just like that for no reason,
something probably happened in your life that led to that. And sometimes people can say, I am like this because of a sexual assault, right? But a lot of times they don’t have that awareness because it’s like,
you know, the, the effect of like a thousand paper cuts in a way, you’re not even aware so much. So you and your therapist, will help to kind of excavate and discover and we have specific techniques that help to trace back where all that yuck is coming from.
And then once we identify, okay, these are kind of the memories. These are the experiences that seem to be driving those symptoms. We use a specific protocol that asks the client, so think about that memory.
Notice the feelings, the images, the thoughts that come to mind, what you notice in your body. And as you think about that, follow my fingers. And we start the bilateral stimulation side to side,
or the client starts tapping back and forth, or we start audio that beeps back and forth. And when I first learned about EMDR, I was like, what is this BLS? This sounds absurd. What is happening?
This sounds really hocus pocus. I don’t believe this, but what the research shows is that the bilateral stimulation is a necessary ingredient. for EMDR to work,
that without it, you just don’t get the same effect. So like, what the heck is going on there? We don’t exactly know, ’cause we don’t know how any therapy works. We don’t even know why we sleep. We don’t know how Prozac works. We just know that it seems to work and we have some hypotheses.
Some of the things that we believe are happening with bilateral stimulation is that it starts a similar process to what we go through in REM sleep. So when REM sleep, your eyes start going back in.
forth it’s believed to be a super important part of memory reconciliation. So your brain being able to kind of file away all the experiences of the day so you wake up tomorrow feeling like I’m over that or I know what to do about that thing or I just feel like it’s a new day.
And so it can start a similar process to that. The other way we think it works is that when you receive the bilateral stimulation and you’re trying to focus on that yucky thing that happened,
it’s really hard to pay attention to both. So it’s hard to focus on me moving my fingers in front of your face while you’re also trying to think about that yucky thing. And that is a really important thing that has a positive effect on our neurobiology.
And so for example, if I asked you to think about something of setting while you also played Tetris, well, it’s not… completely bilateral, it’s really distracting. And there’s this taxation to our memory networks that can allow us to kind of lose the emotional intensity with upsetting experiences.
So it’s like impossible to be super upset and distracted at the same time. And what happens in our neurobiology is that it kind of breaks the memory. So all of a sudden we’re like, oh my gosh,
I don’t feel so overwhelmed. Now how exactly that happens in your neurobiology? system and why Mother Nature made us like that, I’m not sure, but that’s been shown in studies like way before EMDR even existed.
So, and all of that, how long it takes your other question calling completely depends on the client because it’s really about the state of your nervous system.
So, for example, let’s say, we were gonna go run together, like we were gonna go run together. go run. I hate running. So I was going to say, not me, but maybe Bridget. I used to.
I didn’t run anymore. So let’s say Bridget is like, I run every day. I run five miles a day. And so Bridget’s like, let’s go run for seven miles together.
Bridget has a lot of fitness in her body, right? Like she’s training. She’s got the cardiac capacity to do that. Her muscles can support that. And she’s rigid. It’s like, I can run seven miles.
But meanwhile, I’m like, I never run. I hate running. If I try and do that, I’m going to feel terrible. I will fail. It will not work. I can run maybe like a block with you. So we can think about the same for EMDR and how long it takes depending on the state of someone’s nervous system.
So if somebody comes in and they say, you know, I’m a mess inside, but I’m, you know, doing things to take care of myself, I’m really engaged in self care and wellness, I’m using techniques,
I’m using mindfulness, I, you know, exercising and prioritizing my sleep and my nutrition. That person probably has more kind of neurophysiological fitness in their nervous system to handle the hard lift of EMDR like EMDR is not a walk in the park,
it’s like physical therapy for your brain, it’s some work. First, if somebody comes in and they say, “I don’t prioritize my sleep. I don’t eat well. I never use mindfulness techniques.
The only way I manage my emotions is I distract with binge -watching TV or numbing with food or social media.” We got some work to do on the front end to make sure that I don’t try and ask you to run seven miles and you end up flat on your face.
So it depends. So some people come in, it’s like, hey, EMDR might take you a couple of weeks, maybe a couple of months. And other folks who are struggling with more kind of chronic, consistent levels of dysregulation,
who might be looking at like many months, like more than six months to even some folks, maybe a couple of years, because sometimes that beginning phase of just like training your nervous system to get to the point where you could hand processing those memories that that’s really the key piece that that can take a different amount of time that’s that’s the key phase yeah.
So you’ve been doing this for a while like you know it’s it’s um EMDR has really just kind of come into the I don’t know you know the universe are not the universe but most the population is really hearing more about it lately maybe since right before the pandemic but you’ve been doing this for a while.
So how did you get into it? Yeah, so EMDR was discovered by Francine Shapiro in the late 80s. And she really kind of entered the stage in the 90s in the counseling field.
And it was ridiculed and mocked in the beginning, because people thought it sounded strange and pseudoscience. So I got trained in EMDR when it was still considered to be controversial and wasn’t well recognized.
and wasn’t in evidence -based therapy. I got trained in 2006. And I was in grad school at that time and I was on a trauma therapy specialty track. So I was interning at a rape crisis center.
I had done an internship in Bosnia over that summer. So I was just immersed in learning about trauma and how to treat trauma. And at the rape crisis center, I was interning at both of my supervisors were trained in EMDR and just said amazing things about it and how impactful it was for their clients.
They’re like, you should really consider getting trained in this. And so I had all this support to get trained in it, which I would say back in 2006 was very unique. If I had been in any other internship, I probably wouldn’t have gotten that level of support and encouragement.
So I went and got trained. I found it to be incredibly impactful for myself because to get trained you have to actually practice EMDR. on each other so you actually figure out how it works and I mean I have personally used EMDR multiple times throughout my life on huge traumas,
big tea traumas and small things and it is just one of my go -tos in my healing medicine cabinet I would say. So I started practicing in 2006, found it to just be game changers for some of my clients because one of the beautiful things about EMDR is it’s not just about putting on band -aids It’s it’s not just about let me just teach you how to cope So you have more skills when you get activated The outcome of EMDR
is that people say like I don’t need all those band -aids because it doesn’t hurt anymore And it doesn’t wear off. It’s not like you’ll feel this way for six months Then you don’t need to come back and get another dose.
You know, it’s not like that. It’s really research shows that after people are done with EMDR, they stay better and they actually continue to get better. So it’s like it frees your nervous system of these burdens that you’ve been carrying that after time become a domino effect,
right? You know, you’ve been living in this way for so long and now all of a sudden you added on this symptom and this symptom and this symptom. So when you take out this is the wound. It was causing you so much distress.
You free people of not only the present day suffering, but of future suffering that they may encounter because of just that chronic, chronic percolation of stress.
– I was gonna ask you about how long it could last, but you just answered the question. – Yeah. – Yeah. my next question would be, does it matter what stimulation you use for each particular trauma?
Like could you do tapping for any of them? Could you do line movement for any of them? – Great question. So I’ll answer based on what the research says and I’m also gonna answer based on my actual lived clinical experience.
Because I do train in EMDR, I’ve trained, my company has trained well over 5 ,000 therapists, so we know her thing or two about what this looks like. So the research is most supportive of the effect of eye movements across the board.
So it’s not, if you have this trauma, you should do this kind of BLS, if you have this trauma, you should do this. Eye movements are shown to be the most impactful. But what I’ve personally found from my own research,
know, receiving EMDR, from applying EMDR with clients and training therapists is that it’s really about that person’s preference. Because the research doesn’t,
the research has very heavily studied the effect of eye movements, and it hasn’t equally studied the effect of tapping or tones. So while the research says eye movements are most effective,
they’re not the same population sample. that you’re comparing, right? It’s like, we got four apples over here and we’re comparing it to like 20 bananas. It’s not really fair.
I think when you’ll see out there, maybe in certain places if you dive into some research of it says eye movements are number one and that’s my criticism of like, are they? I don’t think we have an equal amount of research to pull from because most clients,
I find actually prefer tapping because you can call it eye movements. you’re tapping. And for some people that’s useful for them to be able to connect more inside and be with the experience.
And some people can’t do eye movements because of TDIs maybe, because they have an eye disorder because they have visual issues. Now you can still do eye movements even if you are sight impaired or fully legally blind ’cause it’s not about the sight,
it’s not about what you’re seeing. It’s about what you’re seeing. movement of the eyes. And so I’ve worked with therapists and clients who are visually impaired to fully legally blind and they’ve used eye movements and it’s had a great effect for them.
So if you are going to EMDR therapy, don’t think like, oh, this is the form of BLS I should be using. You should be using the form of BLS that feels right to your nervous system. And you try all of the forms of it.
and see which one works best for you. – Yeah, that’s what an EMDR therapist should do is say, so here’s some options. Do you like vanilla or strawberry or chocolates?
And you know what, if one day you say, you know, I’ve been enjoying chocolate, like I’ve been enjoying eye movements, but today I think I wanna do tapping, I want some vanilla, like go for that. – But you’re also not committed to the same form.
a BLS throughout the process. You can change based on what your nervous system just prefers. So if you, oh, I was just gonna say as you go in for this,
can you, if you experience something or if you’re on your own and you just have this flashback of something that really bothered you, are there skills that you can take,
even if you’re not finished with the therapy that you’re going through? Are there skills that you can apply? – Yeah, so EMDR is a memory -based therapy. We focus all on the storage of memory and how the storage of memory leads to health illness or dis -ease and pathology.
And what we know about memories is our memory works. So memories can get connected. They form kind of neural networks where synapses link up and…
they fire together. And so, you know, sometimes you’re thinking about, I’ll just give an example. So a couple of years ago, I was, this example is just fresh,
because I use this a lot in my teaching. But I was on the beach and I was watching some kids fly a kite. And, you know, they were just so happy and joyous.
And I was standing there just like really enjoying that moment, just feeling it. And all of a sudden, I started thinking, about flying kites when I was a kid with my dad so all of a sudden like that takes me back into my memories of flying kites with my kid with as a kid and then all of a sudden my memory network shift and they take me to all the grief and loss I felt about my dad’s passing,
which I was still very much feeling and kind of riling in in the moment my dad ended his life by suicide and at that time I was just still feeling a lot of grief around that.
And so in that moment, you know, I’m thinking about planning kites with my dad, and because my memory networks are connected, all of a sudden now I’m feeling the grief and loss of his, of his death,
and then I go into all the narrative related to his death. And right, so that’s how our memories work. So when you’re in EMDR, you might be working on one memory. In fact, this is absolutely how EMDR works.
And now you’re like thinking of something else. And it might be very clear of, you know, like a combat veteran saying, now I’m thinking of this other really scary thing from combat, or it might be something that doesn’t feel related at all.
Like, I don’t know, all of a sudden, now I’m thinking of this other time from childhood that wasn’t about combat, but I still felt really out of control, felt out of danger. And so memories get connected based on similar events.
similar sounds, thoughts, feelings, body sensation, smells. And sometimes we can very clearly say, I get why that’s connected. And sometimes you don’t exactly know. And that absolutely comes up in EMDR processing,
you kind of bippity bop around in your memory networks, but it’s all connected. And so you can think about when you receive EMDR therapy, you’re not really just working on one yucky experience.
You are going to have an effect on that experience. and anything else that’s tied and connected to it, whether it’s in your conscious awareness or not. And by the way, I use the MTR a lot to get through that experience with my dad and I don’t know how I would have gotten through that time without the MTR to be honest.
I’m so sorry that you had to go through that. Yeah, I’m so sorry. But yeah, I would think that that would help. if a situation arises like that for you.
– Does the research indicate that there are certain traumas that EMDR just is not a good treatment for? – That’s a wonderful question.
I would say mostly no. The only caveat I would say is when we’re working with complex trauma and attachment trauma specifically. especially when it’s really young and I don’t think it’s that EMDR isn’t effective for that kind of stuff.
So when I say complex trauma and attachment trauma, I’m talking about growing up when, you know, in an environment where you didn’t have safe caregivers, you didn’t feel nurtured,
you didn’t feel loved, you didn’t feel adored. And those are things that we often miss, you know, well, nobody was. I mean, certainly if somebody was physically causing you harm.
That’s very complex, but sometimes people come and it’s like, well, I had food and I had a roof over my house and nobody was hurting me, but I didn’t feel loved. That’s very complex in neurobiology because you need to feel loved and nurtured to develop a healthy resilient nervous system.
And it’s not that EMDR isn’t effective with that stuff. I will say, honestly, there’s no therapy. that is just like, Oh, my gosh, this is the thing.
It heals that stuff. Like, those experiences are just so complex for our nervous system. And because they’re early young experiences, they kind of set the stage for the rest of our neuro development.
So EMDR can be effective with that stuff. But it’s not, you don’t get the same robust outcomes as you see of, you know, I was coming to you because of my dad or because of a combat trauma.
Just because it’s, it’s, it’s complex. It’s thick, right. There’s a lot of memories that have fired and wired together and EMDR can make a dense can have an impact.
But we just really don’t have any therapy that is, I think, performing the way we would like it to to help those individuals. Can I follow up on that and just say?
what about traumas that are you’re currently in? Like if you’re a cancer patient going through treatment or you’re you’re have a family member in hospice, can EMDR help current trauma?
That is such a good question. Yes, it absolutely can. So EMDR won’t get you to a point with that stuff where you’re like, I’m fine, it’s wonderful, but it will get you a little bit more peace and resolve.
So I’m just I believe in being very transparent and real and vulnerable. So going back to the story with my dad, so his, the end of his life was like a slow car accident.
It was about two years of things like really falling apart and some super traumatic tragic things happening that then ended in him making that choice. And when that started,
there was something very traumatic that happened that I was involved in and I witnessed and had a role in and it involved the police and a gun and a lot of scary stuff happening and when that happened,
I called one of my EMDR colleagues and I said this terrible thing just happened. And the most traumatic thing in my life, I need EMDR so that this doesn’t turn into something bigger. I went and got EMDR on that experience the following week.
And I continued to get EMDR periodically throughout those two years where just this kind of lifetime movie kind of narrative unfolded in my life, but getting EMDR in the beginning was so helpful for me.
I mean, it still hurt. I was still broken. I was still devastated. There were so many tears and so much anxiety, but it made at least that super true. night more bearable,
more tolerable. It reduced some of my symptoms and I think it really helped the kind of long -term impact of that event on my nervous system. So if you are currently going through something,
while EMDR isn’t going to help you find peace, it’s not about finding forgiveness necessarily, it can give your nervous system some buoyancy and it can also prevent that experience from potentially just kind of percolating in your nervous system and turning into something much bigger,
like full blown diagnosis of depression, panic disorder, developing some really maladaptive coping traits like addictions or developing PTSD. So it can be very preventative in nature.
And in fact, there are protocols for recent traumatic events, percolating. folks who have just gone through something. And the research is really showing that those protocols seem to be promising in not only reducing acute symptoms following a traumatic event,
like you can go get EMDR the next day after something happens. There’s not really a timeframe you need to wait, like get yourself to EMDR right away. But those protocols also seem to really prevent the worsening of those symptoms over time.
Is EMDR available like nationwide or all over is it can be found or people who and not on tiktok because it’s not the right one do not do VMDR on yourself I cannot emphasize that enough you know we’re all looking for hacks and like the magic bullet and a quick relief and just your nervous system doesn’t work like that.
And such an important piece of EMDR is the presence of another safe, supportive, regulating human being. Like I don’t even do EMDR on myself. I might use little pieces of it sometimes,
but when I have really big things, I’m like, I need somebody else to guide me through this ’cause I can’t be objective and subjective at the same time. And so you really, EMDR is a therapy. You can’t do therapy on yourself.
It just doesn’t work like that. So please don’t listen to TikTok videos of this is how you do EMDR on yourself. Don’t get those stupid books that say this is how to EMDR yourself or any app. Do not do it.
You could make things a lot worse. It could really suck. EMDR is recognized by all insurance companies. It’s not diagnosis specific recognized by Medicaid and Medicare and all private insurance companies.
So it’s not like you have to have a specific diagnosis to receive EMDR. EMDR is practiced on every continent. It is recognized worldwide and there’s also no age limit.
There’s actually therapists who specialize in EMDR with infants. That really boggles my mind, but it works great with kids and especially for itty -bitty kids. They don’t have all those memories.
They don’t have all those neural networks that are going. them up. So they can process really fast, like really fast, like 10 minutes sometimes, super quick, where as an adult,
we got a lot of stuff we’re holding on to. So that might take a little longer when you’re in your 30s and 40s and 60s and 70s and 80s, because you’ve got a lot of memories that you’re holding on to. But it is effective across the age range.
It is effective across cultures, across land. because it’s really based on your neurobiology. – So if you were interested in finding someone local who did EMDR,
is there a website they can go to or found a company? – Yes, so my recommendations if you are in North America is to check out mdria .org.
That is emdrinternationalassociation .org. .org. So Andrea in North America is the governing body of all things EMDR. So they’re like the regulatory board for EMDR therapists.
They set the standards of what it means to be trained in EMDR. They approve EMDR trainings and trainers and they have a ton of resources on their website.
So you can geek out on information and research. You can also find a therapist there. So you can easily go there and find a therapist. You can also receive EMDR over telehealth.
So if you’re somewhere where you’re kind of in a real location or you can’t get out of the house, telehealth works great. I, in fact, my private practice is only telehealth now and I do EMDR all the time.
So it works fantastic. So mdria .org, if you are in another country, there’s EMDR Asia, there’s EMDR Europe, there’s EMDR Australia. So there’s,
I think I’m forgetting one in this moment, I believe, but there’s other EMDR governing bodies depending on your geographical region in the world. The other place that I recommend and checking out is psychologytoday .com.
I just love psychologytoday .com to look for therapists because of their search options, how you can filter. So you can search by your… zip code.
You can search by cities or a state. You can look for folks who have specialties and you can pick EMDR as a specialty. You can also pick if you want somebody who specializes in women’s issues or specializes in kids or adolescents.
You can ask for, you know, filter this based on symptoms or issues, you know, like depression or anxiety. And you can see who is EMDR trained on this. It gives you their picture,
some of their bio and then a link to their website. Now, not all EMDR therapists are created equal. So I also want to share this, just like there’s all this stuff out there that says,
go EMDR yourself. And I’m like, no, please do not do that. There are companies out there who are training people who are not Andrea approved. So meaning that training company is not approved by Andrea.
And it’s just not approved by Andrea. find somebody who has been trained to Andrea standards because if they haven’t been trained that way,
there’s a very high likelihood that they are not practicing correctly. They’re not, they are out of their scope of competence. And so always ask, I mean,
if you’re looking for somebody through the Andrea website, they’re trained by Andrea, you can’t be on that site otherwise. But if you find somebody… with your psychology to date or another source asked, are you trained,
you know, was your training an Andrea approved training? And I also encourage you to ask, do you go to consultation? Do you go to additional EMDR trainings? There’s a lot of breadth and depth to EMDR because it’s not just an intervention.
So somebody says, I was trained in EMDR 20 years ago, but I haven’t gone to any trainings. I’ve never gone to consultation. I would be wary of that clinician because they’ve probably gotten some drift.
You know, like you want your doctors to hopefully be reading research and to consult with other providers and to be going to health conferences and things. So you know that they’re up to date on the best practices.
So you want that same standard of competency for your EMDR therapist. So ideally that therapist says, “Yeah, I go to EMDR trainings usually, “you know, a couple of years.” or at least once a year,
I get consultation when I need or I’m in an ongoing consultation group because otherwise I find that there can be vast differences in people’s competency and the outcomes that clients experience,
there is bad EMDR therapy out there. You can get bad EMDR therapy because people are out of their competency. But you all, you do training,
is that correct? Yeah, you do training. – Yes, so case and co, we are an Andrea approved training provider. We’re approved by a number of other continuing education boards. We are fully legit. We are the largest EMDR training company in the country because of all the various trainings that we offer.
So we offer EMDR basic training. We offer advanced trainings. We do consultation. We have a whole path for clinicians to make sure that they are aligned, they are practicing. with integrity,
and they’re practicing to the standard that we hold at Case and Co, which is pretty high. Well, that was really interesting to know about EMDR. Thank you so much for taking the time,
Rebecca, to speak with us. We’ll have your website link in the show notes. So thank you for all you’re doing and for sharing EMDR with us today. Yeah, very interesting.
It is. – Thank you. – Thank you so much. I love talking about this stuff. And you know, we all need, we all got a feel in this lifetime, right? – Oh yes. – Everybody has. – There’s a lot going on.
– Oh true. – There is. – Thank you. (upbeat music)