Debra Morrison: Episode Link

Transcript:

Colleen:  Welcome back to Hot Flashes and Cool Topics Podcast.

Today we are talking with Debra Morrison and we are going to talk finances guys. So get

ready for it. Welcome to the show

Debra: Thank you so much. I’m really pleased to be with

you guys

Colleen: Well, this is a conversation that a lot of women even in 2025 Still feel

uncomfortable to talk about and I found your TED Talk so interesting because it

kind of dives into feel the fear and do it anyway. Why do you think it’s still

the norm for so many women to be uncomfortable talking about finances?

Debra: Well, you know, Colleen, this is a topic, money, that is loaded,

right? It’s absolutely loaded with a whole host of meaning and tradition and history

and of course the socialization around money for women and particularly older women

like I consider 60 and wiser, right? This has really been horrific in so much as

we were pretty much told, you know, don’t wear your little head over that, you

know, Betty, Bob will handle it, you know. And I say to my Ted, Ted X talk, you

know, that’s great if Bob doesn’t prematurely die or come home and trade you in for

two 30’sand that happens so much right between a hot flash there you are

facing all right so i’m sorry so the fact is that we as women uh or women in

particularly horribly socialized and then you know there’s so much sexism still in

or baked into our systems that God help women that just nose to the grindstone,

do their level best, rise up through some of the corporate glass ceilings, bust a

lot of glass while they’re at it. And then somebody says she’s slept to get there.

Bridgett: Yeah.

Debra: Yeah. And complete eradication of all the effort that women who have busted through

barriers is completely damning. So let’s say you were on her heels,

that little hypothetical, right? Let’s say you were emulating her progress. You want

to– oh, geez. They’re going to say, I slept my way to the top.

So the system realizes you keep one power for woman down.

There’s 7 ,000 or maybe like zero on the end of that that are in her shadow and

are going to take her lead and so if you thwart someone you are going to thwart a

lot and the better that it is for us boys because they continue to feel that

there’s one pie and there’s one way to slice it and nothing given to women granted

to women in recognition of our efforts is doing anything but taking away from them.

And if we could get beyond this limited thinking into much more expansive,

if we could imagine that the world has like a few problems right now, and

particularly the United States of America. And if we were welcoming in the ideas and

the input and the intellect and whatnot, and the humor of women, we’d probably get

to the finish line, certainly in a more equitable and just, you know, distributive

way that, you know, benefits more than the ultra billionaires. And yet there is this

allergy. There’s an allergy to women’s spirits.

And so I’m going to bring it back to money because money, you know, I mean, I was

raised Christian fundamentalist, you know,  botta bing, botta bang. And

so, you know, I talk in my tent, like a little thwarted little, little, well,

on the one hand, you know, we’re kind of, you know, money is kind of evil, even

though that was a really miss-reading of the Bible. And then on the other hand,

like in my Baptist church, you know, we were going to be expected to tithe, tithe

10 % off the top, 10%, not 9%, not 8%, 10 % offerings.

So, okay, if money is so evil, where are we going to get the money to tithe that

offer, right? So there, you want to talk about the Vitamix

into which money and women have been, you know, turned on high, it’s big.

Bridgett:  – So with

women that, you know, like, like you said, somebody traded them in for two 30’s,

you know, this happens and they were, they were not part of their financial life.

They didn’t know where their money was, husband dies or husband divorces. And they

are, they might even be rock bottom. They may have, they may only have $100 in

their checking account. Where is a good place for a woman like that to start?

Debra: – Well, two things are really big messages that I always like to impart.

And one is it’s not your fault,

and it’s your responsibility.

So it’s not your fault you’re socialized horribly. It may or may not be your fault

about the divorce that’s not one of my business. It’s certainly not your fault in

terms of a person dying prematurely. The issue is here we are. I would say to

people that are recovering from grief, what would your person have you do now?

Yes, grief, miss them, talk about them, tell stories, and bring now your intellect

into a space where you can prepare yourself to imagine some next steps.

And so some of that is really starting with, okay, what are my options? And we

don’t stop with two. Because that, you know, that kind of like, well, you ought to

do this, or, you know, live on my own, or keep this house, or I’ll move in with

the kids, right? It’s just the way I said it. It’s just kind of like an almost a

darn if I do, darn if I don’t, right? No, no, I always want three or more.

Now, you know what this does? It keeps us into kind of a visioning and an

imagination zone that we women are capable of, all right? And so what advice could

I give a person that’s just upside the head and just, you know, or single,

all these laws, I’m single, all right? Nobody to converse with.

I have a responsibility, we all have to ourselves to have this conversation. And I

always say, and this is Just obviously, I’m just holding up a heart -shaped mirror,

right? I want to have a conversation with myself that is truthful,

hopeful, and filled with possibility. And that involves me getting real with myself.

Now, I know that we jump right to, “I don’t have enough money. I’ve under -saved.

I’ve under -vested. Whoa is me. I’m so stupid you know the self -flagellating right

now nobody heard me say that at the beginning I’m just saying what the typical

response is like don’t tell me that because I can’t do it Well, guess what if you

believe you can or if you believe you can’t you’re probably right So now probably

one of the worst things in life has happened to you in those two circumstances

So there’s a sense by which like that, You know the shine is off the apple right

like now. It’s just like you’re raw and It’s a perfect thing. It’s like clay now

able to be molded And there is so much life ahead of us That I implore each of

us women to take an assessment and find yourself a good money coach I Happen to be

serving as one and yet there are you know hundreds out there well Well, there are

thousands out there. Some of them were unemployed yesterday. But the fact is you

want to get into some type of a relationship with someone that you can trust.

And here’s the qualifier. That person is not gonna earn a commission on a product

they’re gonna sell you.

Zero. So if you’re looking up coaches of any stripe around money.

Here’s the question you have to ask them. Even though some skin in and say they’re

a fiduciary planner, I was a fiduciary fee only planner the last 22 years of my 42

years of practicing experience as a financial planner. So fiduciary used to be the

buzzword, a differentiated commission from non -commission, but then there are people

that call themselves a fiduciary for the planning and then open up a second or four

other companies in which they sell high commissionable products. So the question we

have to ask, because we have to ask good questions women.

If I do business with you, if I enter into a relationship with you, a professional

relationship, and I were to purchase any financial product, will you receive a

commission referral fee kickback of any sort? And if the answer is yes,

turn on your heels and go someplace else. So we can give you a link for fee -only

planners. It’s NAPFA, National Association of Personal Financial Advisors,

dot org. NAP is in Paul, F is in Frank A, dot org. That’s a good place to find

an actual fiduciary planner or there’s a network of fee -only planners that deal with

people with lesser assets, which might be good for a person starting out. And it’s

a Garrett financial advisors. And I’m sorry, I don’t have that memorized, but Garrett

g a r r e t t, you’ll find it.

Bridgett: Not like my last name. Yeah.

Debra: Yeah, okay. If you’re if you’re diving into the world,

whatever your circumstances, whether your divorce, your widowed, or you’re just turning

40, 50, saying, you know, I need to educate myself on, I need to have some control

over my own financial being.

Colleen: Where is kind of the first place you should look?

Documents? Should you look at your checking account? Like, where do you start?

Debra: Well, it’s a really good question. And as a practitioner, I was quite aware of the

inevitability of time. And so, but no one even had to tell me, I just realized,

holy moly, we gotta take care of the risks first. So we deal with the insurances,

for example, right? Now some of the risks in life, you bear yourself like in the

form of a deductible, let’s say on your homeowners or your car insurance policy,

you’re going to be responsible for the first, however much your deductible is $500,

that’s yours.

And then above that, you’re passing it on to an insurance company in exchange for a

premium, right? So that’s really the essence of risk. You’re going to assume some of

it. And then the groups of zero risk, as I call it, the loss of a partner’s

income, right? The loss of your own income and a disability, for example,

the potential for liability, those you’re passing on to an insurance company. And I

don’t want us to be short -sighted on that because I’m off to say, you know, one

lawsuit can ruin your entire morning. So you do not want to avoid looking at

covering your risks. And, you know, people say to me, and I say to people like,

you know, okay, do you have an umbrella policy? And some people say no, and that

horrifies me. So, and then some people say, yes, and it’s kind of like a check

mark, right? Yep, I got it. They’re in their armpit and their stuff in the back. I

said, “Great, how much did you have?” “Million dollars,” because that’s kind of how

it’s sold. That’s the minimum policy. What’s your net worth? Oh, three and a half

million. Oh, I see. You think someone’s going to sue you for a million? So umbrella

liability insurance is really good, better to have a million than nothing, but let’s

be real. If a woman can sue McDonald’s for $88 million dumping her own hot coffee

in her own lap, and you or I are charged with maiming or killing someone on the

road or someone slips on our front step.

They’re not suing us for a hundred thousand dollars. So let’s cover the real

vulnerabilities because the decision of whether to invest in Microsoft or Nvidia is

really quite beside the point at that time. So let’s deal with the risks first,

and then we’re going to go about doing some type of a collection and an assessment,

right? Like, let’s imagine you walked into, well,

if you have kids or you know kids, like walked into the kids room and typically

they’re kind of a little messy, right? So you’re like, you say, oh, all right, take

an inventory here, we’ve got the toys, some of the toys belong here, some of them

don’t, right? You just take an inventory, You get an idea and then you start to

make order to it. So if you’ve been too afraid to open statements, for example,

or to look at your finances, then that’s the first way of doing it. And many

coaches will take you through a very, very easy step -by -step exercise in this.

That’s actually fun, right? See, we tend to, in life, fear as human beings,

fear the unknown, right? kind of normal. That’s the job of our subconscious to

protect us. But guess what? Guess what? More than a million times, people say after

they deal with a professional  and they’re coaching the right, say, “I wasn’t

as bad off as I thought.” That is exactly the comment I hear, like widow after

widow after widow, because I was like doing a lot of widow counseling for a long

time. And when they were nervous. They were afraid. They were uneducated about money

and we talk and we’d assess and they would start to sit up a little bit more

erect in their chair and they said, “It’s not as bad as I feared.” If we’re not

paying ourself first, that’s a great place to start.

Colleen: What do you mean by that?

Debra: Great question. So I’ll be in the front of an audience.

I’ll say, you know, who gets paid first, your electric company or you?

Colleen: Electric company?

Debra: Why? Oh, because that’s automatic out of my check -in account. Oh,

I see. How about we set up a savings account and you might have it through your

employer to fund your 401k or 403b? And if you do, God love you. That’s qualified

retirement, monthly. I also suggest having a systematic savings plan so whether you

choose a company or whether I mean you know I I don’t get any money from them but

I a lot use betterment for a lot of my group coaches coaching programs and people

like to very low cost and minimum a dollar a month right we can do this see I am

not asking you to put away you know a thousand dollars a month I’m saying set up

a systematic savings or investment plan for yourself. You know what this does?

Start to give us the confidence. Hey, you give a statement in the mail or maybe

electronically and you say, “Hey, I got I got eight units this month and next month

you put in the same amount, boom, boom, boom, or twice a month. However you the

frequency, I don’t care. I want to get that and for the listeners, I’m doing a

motion. Get your hand into your pocket. I want to get that motion started because

Once that starts and you get a sniff of your being able to do it,

you’ve logged a win and now you’re going to have another win because the next time,

if you did it twice a month or once a month, a similar amount goes in and you

have more units and more units. I never want you to, this is a big tip, never

want us to look at the balance. Well, I put $100, it’s only worth $85.

All right, get over yourself. Look at the number of units you have.

I will tell you, this is one of the biggest tips probably the entire interview. If

you take nothing away, go on a systematic savings plan, even look at your 401 (k)

403 (b) balance. And you’re gonna see the number of units go up and up and up.

So here’s the clue. People get a little nervous when the stock market and the

price of stocks goes down.

That is when you buy more units. Here’s the math,

a hundred bucks a month. Let’s say whatever you’re buying is $10 a share. The first

month you bought 10 shares. Let’s be extreme. It goes down 50, percent. Now it’s $5

a share in the next month. You’re still saving $100. $100 divided by $5 is $20.

You’ve got 20 units in the second month on top of the 10 units on the first month

because the price changes all the time.

We don’t care about the price now because we’re not selling.

I hope that’s landing for people, because if we focus on the units, what we want,

now this, if you have your chair, you know, something standing near a counter, hang

on.

You want the market to go straight down when you’re investing systematic.

And why is that? You’re buying more and more units. So here’s the deal.

Our investments, for the listeners, I’m holding up 10 digits. If you’re lucky enough

to have two hands and five digits on each one, they’re going to hold different

positions. Some of these accounts are gonna be positive this Monday. Some of them

are gonna be negative. Some of them, and I have them gyrating in positions of being

up or down. The fact is, when you’re diversified, you’re going to have a number of

different investment types from which to choose where your next withdrawal will be,

whether it’s way out in retirement or whether it’s to upgrade your bathroom or put

your kid in college.

And so we want to be unit accumulators. And if you can land with that concept,

Now, we are going to perceive ourselves as winning, and guess what? That’s the first

step.

Bridgett: So, when you were talking about units and being well -diversified,

what, I know, I don’t know, you know, like individual stocks versus mutual funds,

how should a woman in our demographic be?

Colleen:  It’s overwhelming for a lot of women to

look at that and say, “I’m 50, where do I start?”

Debra:  Yeah, yeah. A great,

great point. Well, I had always said, and I still believe it’s wise that we have

at least a quarter million dollars in mutual funds, or they’re like, kind of look

like exchange traded funds, ETFs, exchange traded funds, before we buy one individual

stock. Now, maybe your grandfather and your father and you all worked at the same

company for like a million years and you’re in love with this company, there was a

stock purchase plan. Okay. So you might have this one stock for a reason. All

right. However, generally speaking, we want to diversify our risk.

You know, IBM seems to kind of hold true more than even, oh, what’s the bank and

trust or something and best, I don’t know, but IBM, big blue, right? Used to

be all of our computers were big blue. That stock went like, you know, Bank of

America in the ’50s and ’60s went to $3 a share. It happens to big companies.

Now, each of these companies came back, but some of them don’t. Why would you set

yourself up for the potential for more risk than what you need to take. So what

you’re doing by buying the standard and poor 500 index, for example, a mutual fund

or an index, something that mirrors an index is you’re buying, and I’m saying for

the listening audience, I’m making this big kind of a basket with my hand, this

basket of securities. You can have a mutual fund of bonds, you can have a mutual

fund of stocks, you can have a mutual fund of emerging market stocks, all kinds of

things in these baskets, the point I’m making is, if you have 500 stocks or 500

bonds in one container, in one wrapper, and you invest in that,

and one of those companies goes bankrupt, kind of yawning. Sorry that happened,

but it didn’t really set you off your pace. the stock that you had in your

portfolio, it goes down, you know, that’s not a good day. So diversification would

have us be not only invested in mutual funds or I love indexes. You can ever

invest exactly in the index. You invest in something that mirrors the index. All

right, that’s what we have. So your standard of 4 ,500 and you’re gonna have this

as a choice in almost probably every single 401K plan and a 403B plan that

you were offered through your employer if you’re that lucky. So there’s a great

place to start. You see that with stocks for the long term. You want to do stocks

for seven -plus years. You do not want to get involved in investing in stocks or

stock mutual funds. For example, when I say stocks, I mean stock mutual funds for

less than seven years. Can you make money like in a New York minute? Yes, but don’t

count on that, right? So seven plus years. So here’s the deal. We women at this

stage of our life, 50 and North, typically,

we have a shorter timeline than when we were 20. However, unless you have a

terminal illness or a bad diagnosis,

when I was doing planning, I’m figuring on your living to 99. There’s two,

I think two of my four grandparents lived well into their nineties. And I’m talking

to you when it’s not a good idea to imagine that you’re going to live into your

nineties at age 85, right, because you don’t have so much time then to plan it. So

you want to plan for the long term. And here’s the deal.

We as women get it, that we have a spice rack, right, or a drawer or cabinet or

something, aren’t they? Filled with everything from vanilla and cinnamon and cayenne

pepper and dill weed.

You do not put dill weed in a chocolate chip cookie recipe and expect something

that tastes good. So also, you are not well served to invest your retirement funds

in a bond because that’s like sending a girl to do a woman’s job.

Last 80 years of history shows bonds on average, four to 5%, on average,

percent total return. On average, stocks same 80 years of history,

9, 10%. Even with the new meth, that’s double. Now,

no one please go away and say, Debra said stocks are going to make 10 % for the

forever. No, I did not. However, as Mark Twain said,

history may not repeat itself, but it’ll surely run. So we want to be judicious

about the particular types of investments so that they match the recipe we’re

following, we’re tracking. So you’re going to put, you know, you’re going to put

your vanilla in your chocolate chip cookie recipe, typically, and not in your beef

roast, or if you’re a vegetarian in your stew. It’s just, it doesn’t work. There

has to be a recipe and the ingredients that go into it make a difference. And one

more thought on this little tangent. Get your chocolate chip cookie ingredients out

in front of A couple of cups of flour, teaspoon property of baking powder,

you don’t mix them up. You don’t do a teaspoon of flour and a couple cups of

baking powder and expect something good. So you don’t go into the morning star,

you know, I call the tic -tac -toe chart. There’s three across the top, three down

and say, “I’ll have one of these. I’ll have one of these. I’ll have one of these.”

No.

So there’s an art and a science to this. And I don’t want you to become a

technician because you got your own specialty. I want you to be guided by a person

that’s been there.

Bridgett: What about access? Because when we’re at this age,

retiring or widowed or heading toward retirement perhaps we want to be in different

things where we can have access to our money if we need it. What are some good

areas that we could go where we could have access to our money?

Debra: Well first of all on your own investments you’ll typically have access no matter

like if you set up a systematic savings plan and then you have to abort it for

whatever for whatever reason, you go in there and you pull it out. So it might be

at a lower price than what you put it in, whatever, there might be a little bit

of a, well, if you get into like a commission rich product, like an annuity, God

forbid, there’s a penalty to pull that out, right? There is, so that’s why you’re

not gonna buy a commission product, right? ‘Cause there are fee -only people out

there that are able to sell you fee -only products,

right? Almost void of commission, almost the whole gamut. I think almost every

product, you don’t have to pay commission, right?

And so my point is, now listen, if all the commission sales people in the world,

you know, really put the consumer’s interest first, I wouldn’t really need to talk

like this, but they don’t. So the fiduciary planner is the only person, if you can

imagine this, that signs an oath and they don’t even need to sign the oath ’cause

that’s how we were wired, right? To put the client’s interest first. Your broker

does not sign anything, adhere to anything, to putting you first. So why would we

continue to pay his boat payment, right? No, no. So the point is access is

something that you will have varying degrees of probably based upon the investments

that you have. So typically a bond is not going to have as much price volatility

as would a stock. Now does that mean bonds are safe and we can’t lose money in

bonds? No, no that’s not what I said. You can lose a lot of money in bonds and

you can lose a lot of money in stocks if you’re not judicious and you can make a

lot of money in bonds and you can make even more money in stocks if you are

judicious. So let’s have our be um suited from a type which has to do with about

how long will they be in the oven right so our little cookie recipe right a

chocolate chip cake a chocolate cake right 350 in the oven for an hour you put all

these good ingredients in the cake mix it beat it all up and you slam it in the

oven for an hour 350 and in 20 minutes you’re real curious and you open the door

and you jerk it out.

You know, you’re no longer curious. You see it. The cake will fall. It’s not going

to turn out well. So you don’t go into stocks whose recipe says an hour. And in

four minutes, you come back out and you pull it off. You have access. It won’t be

pretty. Now, the other thing, if you’re a homeowner, you would be wise, I think,

to establish a home equity line of credit. HELOC, home equity line of credit.

HELOC. That, if you don’t have a problem with that, and if you do,

don’t do it, but if you don’t, then that serves like a line of credit with the

equity of your home behind it. So the bank’s willing to give it to you because

they’ll take your home if You fall on it. However, everybody knows it’s smart to

have an emergency fund. How many people were flat footed when the pandemic hit? A

lot. And they were rescued by the government giving money. And the government did a

wise thing because we’d have fallen right into depression. So I’m not casting blame

or anything. I’m just saying that if you felt flat footed in the pandemic or

anything else, Like if you’re partnered and your partner got laid off or you, you

know, entrepreneur and you have less gigs now, whatever it is, that’s when your

emergency fund comes into play and you’re like, oh, I can’t seem to find my

emergency fund. Oh, I guess I never made an emergency fund. So like what’s the

adage? Six months of your living expenses in an emergency fund. How about this? if

we’re under -saved already for any number of reasons,

then if we don’t have a problem with debt, then instead of having $35 ,000 over

here in a money market that’s serving as an emergency fund for the up potential and

it might never happen, awkward, maybe we established the HELOC over here so that if

we have a hole on the roof and we need to fix it for $10 ,000. We write the roofer

a check this afternoon, they fix the roof and it goes under our home equity

line and now we take a look at our investment portfolio and say should we sell

something out of here to repay the home equity line or do we just keep that for a

little while because the market’s a little bit flimsy and we wait for the situation

to be such that we’ll shore these things up. You see how that frees up us having

30 or whatever six months of your expenses are in a basically interest only

account.

Colleen:  What is your opinion on long -term health care?

Well, so many of us are going to need long -term health care.

And some of us who are lucky enough to just face plant into our Cheerios bowl.

Differences the problem is we don’t know who will, so

My parents now are both deceased that died just this past September mom died the

previous June They both went into that moved out of their home into an adult

community where there was care built in and as they Regressed in their health. they

went into elevated levels of care and that’s how they’ve lived the last few months

and years of their life and we were very grateful for that and of course we had

home healthcare come in and so forth so the fact is some

people say well you know I got kids, oh I see

you’ve got kids I’m not sure how many are going to come and be the caregiver like

probably  none because kind of like kids people have their lives

so I think it’s an interesting idea and and I own two policies on myself I’m

single I don’t I don’t imagine anybody else going to be taking care of me so I’d

like to be able to pay someone to take care of me whether it’s in my home or in

his facility I don’t you know hopefully that’s a few years away. The issue is there

are policies out there now like I make a like an analogy to like a Christmas tree

like you buy a Christmas tree and like my dad like and it was a big big joke if

he bought a Christmas tree that the spine will look like an S curve is like dad

seriously just how about one with this you know straight spine so you buy a long

-term care policy with a straight spine right on it right you don’t like buy one

with 73 ornaments hanging off of it. Like this is a return or premium rider. So if

you don’t use this long -term care, we’ll return your premium. Guess what? You’re

paying like triple between now and then in order to get back this modicum of a

refund. I’m not sure that makes sense, right? Then there’s long -term care that’s

smushed in with life insurance, and you can really never tell the difference. And

then there’s long -term care that’s smushed in with, you know, an annuity, I think

even. But the fact is, here’s an idea that maybe you didn’t think of. So you buy

long -term care by the day. I like the idea of having one policy. Now, self

-publishing. Well, I’m coupled, and we can’t afford to buy it on both of us. You

know what happens statistically?

In a heterosexual marriage, sometimes the male is older, but even if not longevity

-wise, the statistics show he’s gone down first. So if he goes down and his wife is

caregiving him, maybe we buy the long -term care on the wife. Now that really puts

the wife into this like position that, you know, I’m not sitting there, she was

literally choosing necessarily, but the fact is I like to, I have to think about

where I’m going to route my money. And I want my premium money to be routed in

the in the direction and in the percentage in which I believe it’s going to give

me the greatest ROI. It just comes down to that. Okay. And so that might be an

idea. So you buy it by the day. So you know, you look up long term care coverage,

the price of a long term care facility in in the area of whomever you’re talking

about you, your parent, whatever. And if it’s $350 a day, then you might buy a

policy that says $300 a day, and you’re going to buy it for two or three years or

unlimited, which is a very expensive thing. And then you’re going to put an

inflation rider on. I do suggest that inflation rider because inflation, and it won’t

be cheap, and yet it’ll be there.

Colleen: There’s so many issues and so many things to

talk about, and you have a great Facebook group, which shares a lot of thoughts and

conversations, can you share with the audience a little bit about your Facebook

group?

Debra:  – Well, thank you so much. Yes, I have, oh, in the trademark, We Can Do It

Women, if you can believe it. And I was so psyched to get that. And I decided,

you know what? I’m gonna have a Facebook group and we have one called We Can Do

It Women. It’s called 60 Plus Community because the community Facebook page.

Now,

I really have a passion for helping 60 plus year old women because of the

socialization. It’s different than a 40 year old, right? Let’s fill our cup up. And

the overflow from our cup is that from which we give, not at the expense of our

own financial security. So the airlines have it right.

If the oxygen masks drop from the compartment above. Put your own mask on.

I’m in a collaborative book and that’s how I started my chapter. It does not say.

They do not come on and say “if the oxygen mask dropped down, men put your own

oxygen masks on, for women, look to the person to your left. Put their oxygen mask

on. Look to the person to the right and put their oxygen mask. Stand up, look

behind you. put their oxygen masks on in front of you. If you have any air left,

put your own on.” No, they do not say that.

Bridgett: – Yeah, that’s how women have been

raised. That’s what they’ve been doing. So that’s what they’ve been doing,

but I think what’s, it’s so important is that, that that gives them hope. You can

do it even with just a tiny bit of money, even if you feel like you can’t, you

can, you can do something in there. So that’s why we can do it. Thank you so

much, Deborah, for coming on today. We appreciate your time and the conversation. And

thank you so much.

Debra: Well, I appreciate you and your reach and your message.