KAREN DUFFY: EPISODE

TRANSCRIPT:

Colleen: Welcome to the show. We are excited to be talking to Karen Duffy, a friend of ours and of the show.

Welcome back.

Karen: Thank you so much for having me. I’m just over the moon to be here because you keep

me such good company in my ear holes. I have this parasocial relationship with you because I listen

to you all the time. And then when I’m a guest, I’m like, oh, how lovely. It feels like I’m

catching up with friends.

Colleen: Well, we consider that. A compliment. Thank you.

And we appreciate it. And we just, you know, we love talking to you. It’s just so much fun.

And we were on back when Wise Up came out. Yes, your book. And that was an incredible conversation.

We’ll make sure to link it in the show notes. But we want to catch up with you. What has been going

on? I know your son is now almost done college. He was just starting.

Karen: he’s 22 and he’ll be graduating. And it’s a really interesting time.

And what I love about your show is I feel that there’s a very slim

volume of media that is speaking to women in our age group.

And it’s such an incredibly vital time. You know, I was just thinking because,

you know, my son is fully fledged, but now my parents are elderly and there’s more caregiving.

And we’ve always kind of thought of this as the sandwich generation, where you’re caring for kids

and for your elders. When you do this with a chronic illness,

you’re actually a club sandwich because you get an extra layer of obstacle.

But it really had me thinking about how amazing women are and how the unpaid labor of women is

just extraordinary. And I was listening to one of your shows the other day, and it got me thinking,

oh, I’m really going to look this up. And the unpaid labor of women’s kind of,

they call it invisible, with caring for children, caring for elderly or infirmed,

globally, it’s $10 trillion. And in the U.S.,

It’s 625 billion. And I just think, aren’t we awesome? Like, look at what we can do and do it out

of our hearts. It’s really beautiful.

Bridgett: That is amazing. Just when you think about it and put those

numbers to it and you don’t even realize it while you’re doing it. And on top of that, that’s the unpaid

labor. All the women who are also doing paid labor with their unpaid labor as well.

It is amazing. So your son, he’s gone at school.

How was that? How was that when he left for college and now he’s getting ready to embark on life

after that?

Karen Duffy: A whole new life. Well, it’s interesting because I kind of,

I feel like there’s almost a form of self-violence where like when somebody has a new baby and

they say, get your sleep now, or when your child. leaves for school,

like, oh, you know, you’re going to cry every day. But I feel like this is actually,

that’s one way to look at it but look at what a great job we’ve done. And the fact that we’ve,

are launching fully functional young people out into the world.

So no, it was, I think because of that attitude,  I’m very connected to my faith,

but also Stoic philosophy. And Stoic philosophy is a,

we often think of Stoic as like the stiff upper lip. That is,

you know, you’re going to be, a Stoic action would be to kind of muffle your feelings.

But Stoic philosophy is this amazing school of

Greco-Roman philosophy and Marcus Aurelius you may have heard of and Seneca.

And one of the beautiful things of the way you could kind of sum up stoicism is if you make

beautiful choices, you will make a beautiful life. And I think that really kind of boils it down.

Keep making beautiful choices. It really helps.

Bridgett:  With your book, Wise Up,

that was probably one of my first really introductions to stoicism.

And then we had Brigid Delaney on. Was it Everyday Stoic? I can’t quite remember.

Then I was talking to my husband. He bought me The Daily Stoic.

I think your book really led me to look more into stoicism and a different way to look at life.

And just the big thing is your reaction. To what happens.

Karen Duffy:  Yes. There’s a hypothesis that life is 10

% what happens to you and 90% how you respond. And I believe that it is absolutely true.

Bridgett: And the Stoics really believe that what is in our control?

Karen Duffy: Like, well, you know, it’s called the dichotomy of control. And that is to understand what is in

your control and do your best by making the best decisions. And what’s out of your control,

live in agreement with it or find a way to make the best out of it. So I find this to be an

overwhelmingly optimistic school of philosophy. And it’s kind of been co-opted by.

like life hacks. It’s often known as broism, but it truly, uh,

there are some of the best stoic philosophers were for women and women need stoicism just as much

as men. So I’m thrilled to be an evangelist and inspire people to,

um, take it up, take it. It’s a great book by a female stoic is a woman named Sharon LaBelle,

who wrote a book called The Art of Living, which is a masterpiece. It’s the book I give out the

most as a gift and the book that I read over and over. I just get so much out of it.

Bridgett: I’m writing it down right now.

Colleen: You were mentioning that for things that we can’t control,

that we have to find a way to kind of walk with them in life. Can you give us some examples of how

you’ve done that or how your friends have done that? Because I think people say, okay, that’s

great, but how do I do it?

Karen Duffy: Well, I live with a chronic condition called sarcoidosis of the

central nervous system, and through that I have what’s called complex regional pain syndrome.

And it’s a condition of your harm alarm. So our neurological system is always kind of scanning

our body, making sure we’re okay, letting you know if your hand’s too hot, too close to the stove.

But when you have a lesion, which I have in my spinal column,

it’s constantly sending information to my body that there is pain. So I just live in absolute…

constant pain and that is something I cannot control but what I could control is how am I not going

to let the fact that I am in endless pain, I’m not going to let this ruin my life.

I’m just going to deal with it. And so often we use the term, we’re going to fight this or we’re

going to battle this illness. And I realized I don’t want to be thinking about fighting and

battling because I’m a lover, not a fighter. And so I thought, is there a way to peacefully

coexist? And what was in my control was my emotions,

how I was going to… at living in chronic pain for the rest of my life. And I was like,

well, I better get used to it and I better make the best of it. And that’s an ongoing process.

But I feel absolutely that stoic wisdom has,

it was like I was reading the top end of an optometrist eye chart.

And when I read Stoic philosophy, it was like I put on lenses and I could see clearly.

And so that has been a great gift. And I’m thrilled to kind of share it with other people because

it’s added so much. I just love the living of my life. And Stoic wisdom has taught me to live my

life as if my life depended on it. And it does.

Bridgett:  And I think it’s such a good example,

too, because I think people feel they get in this, I don’t know, mode where they are rush,

rush, rush and get things done. But I think what you’re what you share and what your journey’s been

kind of gives people this grace or almost it’s not really permission, but people feel like they

have permission to say, OK, this is happening and I’m going to deal with it and we’re going to just

go on with life. the best that we can. And I think you’re a good example of that, that you don’t

have to push through this so hard that you’re going to make the best of it. So I think it’s a

lovely message.

Karen Duffy:  Well, I believe that pain is inevitable, but suffering can be an option.

So while I live in chronic pain, I don’t suffer.

And a big part of my life is gratitude. And I know the gratitude journals,

they have unbelievable research how that can actually help reframe your life.

And there is visible proof. But I’ve gotten it a little bit differently where I write a thank you

letter every day. And it’s handwritten because I have special stationery that does not have an

address and the reason why it’s not an email is because it’s not about reciprocity. I’m not sending

uh you know and I’m not trying to put a burden of the response on you. All I want to do is say

well done, great job  or I’ve been real at watching you do this and it could be from you know

Marina the diner where I have breakfast most mornings, or it could be somebody I read in the paper,

but looking for things to be grateful. When you start that, it is,

you are just overwhelmed. And a wise man said that gratitude is the greased chute to optimism.

So the more you can feel gratitude, the more I think you can look at life like, hey,

I’m doing pretty good. So that’s been a great lesson.

Colleen: And I can say that you definitely are not

just talking the talk. You’re walking the walk because I will receive emails from you sometimes

just saying that you listened to an episode and you were grateful for it or just such sweet things

that kind of light up my day. And it’s true when you come from a place of gratitude, it’s kind of

hard to have that victim mentality.

Karen Duffy:  Yes. And a friend of mine said, there’s nothing less sexy than

being a victim. And so I think like there’s a lot of things, but I like the fact that she used less

sexy for some reason. That was a funny term of words. But finding ways to just be thankful and just

in the smallest way, it really just lights up my life like the last firecracker on the 4th of July.

I’m really, really grateful.

Colleen: How has that gratitude, because you’re in a long-term relationship

like we are, and has that played a role in your marriage and keeping it happy?

Karen: I would say that I

like liking things. I live life with an enthusiasm,

and I think that’s always been, but especially since my life changed when I married my husband and

became a family with him.

Ralph Waldo Emerson said, “Nothing great in life is ever achieved without enthusiasm.”

So I think being enthusiastic and being grateful. I mean, my husband and I,

whenever he left for a business trip and I always like hide a note in his shoes or in his luggage

 just let him know I’m thinking of him. And, you know, it’s funny. And I see it with

my son. I’ll be like, you know. You did a great job. And he’s like, well, I’ve had great parents.

And it’s lovely seeing my son picking up this way. And how much is in our control?

I mean, the way that we can view our lives. Voltaire said,

“the best gift you can give yourself is the gift of a good mood.”

And it’s not always possible. In the moments that it is possible to find a moment,

to find something that you can feel grateful for, it truly changes the landscape.

And that is absolutely a testament to enthusiasm and gratitude.

Colleen: And you all did you have an anniversary recently? I can’t remember. I follow you on Instagram and

I’ve seen some of the posts, but I can’t remember if it was recent.

Karen Duffy: We’re inching up.

Oh, yeah, we are. My husband and I eloped. So he was my roommate in a beach house and I was

dating a very lovely country singer. But I wound up

running off to Jamaica and eloping with my husband. And the cab driver gave me away and he doubled

as my husband’s best man. And because there was only two of us and the taxi driver,

it was very sweet. My husband said, I’ve looked up because we literally decided to get married

right before we got on the plane. It was so quick that I didn’t have time to break up with my

boyfriend until after I was married. But in church, my husband said,

you know, I’ve looked up very successful partnerships between a husband and wife.

And he read about the Lunt- Fontaines that were very well-known actors and producers.

And when asked about their like 60-year partnership as husband and wife,

he said, what is the secret? And they said, we are always are polite to each other.

 John and I, we are polite to each other.

We don’t, you know, we don’t give each other the finger behind the back or we don’t say what we

call ugly or untidy words. Our cab driver,

when we had to get the marriage license in Jamaica,  he said,

now this is my goal. Never say untidy words. And I thought that is a really nice way.

So I guess I was very nice and polite to my husband, but not so much to my boyfriend, Dwight Yoakam, because I then had to come home and be like, Dwight, we’re breaking up again.

And he was like, all right, baby, what’s it this time? And I was like, nope, I got married on

Friday. And he’s like, I couldn’t find you. And I will tell you, Dwight Yoakam is a man of sterling

integrity. And he, when he met my husband, which was very gracious of him to even meet him,

 he said, you could not have married a better gentleman. So a tip of the hat, a tip of the

cowboy hat to Dwight Yoakam for being such a gem.

Bridgett: That’s a great story.

Colleen: That is a great story. And you’ve kind of opened up the stories of your youth and being a VJ.

And you have dated several celebrities during that time. What was that world like?

Karen Duffy: Well, I guess, you know, Colleen, I felt like I snuck into a party and I was just waiting to get

kicked out. So I figured I am going to have fun. I was working at a

the nursing home in the neighborhood where I live. And I realized that working with Alzheimer’s

patients, that I was impervious to embarrassment. I would do anything to get a response out of my

residence. And I also realized that I was very good with people who had a very short attention

span. And at that time, everyone was saying that MTV was destroying young people’s attention span.

So I kind of reversed engineered. So I went from calling bingo to I made a homemade videotape and I

sent it into MTV on a  Friday and by Tuesday,

I had a screen test. I’d never been on camera before. And I just said yes to life.

And it was amazing. And what’s lovely is I got to become still great friends with the people from

MTV, my esteemed colleagues. And then I met the lovely George Clooney,

who I went to a lot of events with.

It’s extraordinary. When he met my husband, George.

really loves John. And we were out Friday night at watching George’s new movie,

which is called Jay Kelly, which will be on Netflix. And it is a masterpiece. It’s truly,

I love Oh Brother, Where Art Thou? And this movie is truly in the top three.

It is phenomenal. It’s with my friend Adam Sandler and George Clooney,

and they make an unbelievable pair. It is so charming. It’s really great.

Bridgett:  Well,

he’s a fellow Kentuckian. I’m from Kentucky. I do not know him, but I am from Kentucky.

But yeah, it’s just amazing that, you know, your time on MTV,

I was thinking back to when you were on it, and there are a lot of pivotal things that really

happen, especially, like, I didn’t think about really the influence that it had on the election.

On the, was it 92? 92. It was Rock the Vote. Yeah.

Right. I forgot about that. What an impact.

Karen Duffy: It was extraordinary. When I went to George’s screening

on Friday night, the former CEO of MTV was there, Tom Freston,

and we were talking about Rock the Vote because it was what I really liked what MTV did was it was

getting young people to register to vote, but also explain the issues that we were facing.

There was an amazing town hall with Governor Clinton at the time.

And MTV hosted the ball the night of the election,

of the inauguration. And that was really incredible.

I’d only been on MTV for a short time. And there I was like in D.C.

hosting this huge ball. And I had an earpiece and President Clinton’s code name was Elvis.

Elvis is in the room. And Vice President Gore was known as The Colonel.

So that was extraordinary. And it was also culturally with

Michael Jackson being so popular at that time. He had unbelievable videos.

U2. I’m still friends with the guys in U2. I just saw them a couple weeks ago. So it’s been really

nice. And it’s a great treasure. My son was born in the 2000s.

And when he was a little boy, he was like, how do so many people know your name? And I was like,

well, before you were born, I used to work on MTV because they played music and I was the primetime

1. He’s like, oh, that’s crazy talk. MTV doesn’t play music. Like it was funny, but it’s just been

interesting because he just, I don’t know where young kids get their music,

I guess on YouTube or Spotify, but I really do miss and lament because MTV was fun and you always

wanted to watch it.

Bridgett: Absolutely. I miss it. My husband and I talk about how much we miss it.

And now it’s reality shows. When they started, they were kind of like the almost the first reality

show, like The Real World and I loved it.

 So it kind of took away the I the excitement. But I loved music videos so much.

If I just want to turn it on and just see what’s happening with, I’ll go back on YouTube and I will

watch old music videos like from the eighties.

Karen Duffy:  But what’s interesting,

it’s serendipitous that we’re talking because I think MTV is shutting down

all of their channels and there will only be one MTV channel and it will only be reality.

So who could have imagined? I mean, when it started, I believe it started in.

uh, 81. Uh, and I was there from 92 to 96.

Bridgett: Um, I do miss it. Maybe that shows my age. I don’t know. I don’t care.

Karen Duffy:  I think it was, it was a special time, a special period in his unfortunate

history now, but in history that we can’t duplicate now.

It’s just not. possible. I mean, you know, internet, it wasn’t, everything wasn’t social media and

instant gratification. And you looked forward to seeing stuff when it was scheduled. And now it’s

just everything happening all at once that I don’t think you could replicate something like that

now. I think that we have adapted.

I’ve been reading, I read a lot of medical journals and that a short-term video,

so not like the music video, but a short-term TikTok or a reel on Instagram,

I believe that we will have warnings about what this does to our brain the way that we did with

nicotine and smoking. And that what we’re getting is cheap dopamine. We’re getting…

hits of feel-good chemicals because we’re watching something and connecting to it, but then it

happens so quickly that we can get addicted. I read this amazing fact that we touch our phones 3,000 times a day. And that every time we touch our phone, we get a hit of dopamine because we are

expecting good news. And this goes for pessimists. And I thought that is fascinating.

Bridgett: And that is just incredible. That’s, you know, they always say about how movies and film and TV,

they’re at a faster rate than they were in the past. And I have caught myself. If I want to go

back and watch an older movie, I find myself watching Butch Cassidy and the

Sundance Kid I was like I’m gonna watch that, I remember watching that when I was younger and I

started to get bored and I thought, well I wasn’t bored when I watched this the first time what’s wrong

with me, and I think it is it is the more frames per minute when you’re watching newer things so I

bet that whole thing about the short reels and the videos, I’m sure that has something to do

with it.

Karen Duffy:  Absolutely. You know we are what, 40 trillion cells,

our bodies. And our brain, you know, it’s been around,

you know, homosapian, which means wise man.

But Carl Lennius, when they first found the skull in the 1600s, he wanted to call us homo stupidus.

But our brains and bodies are, you know. 10,000,

20,000 years old. And our media is just, our technology is coming at such a swift rate that we

kind of aren’t really sure how it’s going to impact us. So that’s why I really like to read books

and go for walks and have that time where I get to think.

I just read that. Only 16% of Americans read for pleasure last year.

And it’s through reading that we develop our vocabulary and critical thinking.

And so I’m really hoping to get people to read, the people that I love to read more,

because it is such a joy. I just love jumping into it. And you go at your own pace and you make

the movie in your head. So it doesn’t matter how many jump cuts, it’s all in  your noodle.

Colleen: It’s really great. And, you know, it’s interesting because as you’re saying that, I’m thinking

that, you know, as we get to this time of life, we appreciate the stillness and the quiet and the

slowing of a pace where I don’t know that the next generations are even going to think that way

because they’re so used to this fast pace. They don’t know any different.

And so it’s weird to think that we’re just kind of entering this time where it’s okay to sit and

read a book or to take a walk when they’re just going and going and going. Will they ever reach

that point? It’s like we’re in the high impact program.

Karen Duffy:  You know, it’s at this accelerated pace.

But I think that’s what happened during the dawn of like the automotive age.

I mean, there was a belief that women, we could not go over 20 miles an hour or they thought that

our uterus would fly out of our bodies there’s been so much. I mean it is funny that hysteria comes

from the Latin word for uterus so that’s what’s called a hysterectomy. It’s hysteria um

and women were not allowed to ride roller coasters again because of the fear of how

it would affect uh fertility, so we tend to get more educated and learn more but  I’m so grateful that I live in this age.  I mean to be alive and I understand we have

a lot of problems but I have great hope. I feel optimistic.

And I love being this age. I would never want to trade knocking off being younger again.

I love being this. I mean, I remember when your baby grandson was born,

just thinking about what the only creatures on earth that live beyond fertility,

are killer whales and humans. And there’s something called the grandmother hypothesis,

which states that it is because of grandmothers that our civilization has carried on because it is

the grandmothers who, number one, for education, like every other at Mammal. or an animal dies

right after reproductive viability. But with humans,

our gift is to care for the baby,

care for the mother and the new family, also great for farming. And I just really love that the

grandmother hypothesis should absolutely be celebrated by all of us.

Bridgett: Yes,

 Dr. Mindy Pelz mentions it in her book as well,

The Grandmother Hypothesis. There was a tribe, the group of

women where they would go out all day and gather food to bring back to the family because the men

were the hunters and the hunters were gone for maybe two or three days at a time. So to feed them

in between, it was the grandmothers. So Colleen, if I see you out foraging!

Colleen: you’ll know what I’m

doing.

Bridgett:  But it contributed to longevity as well because they were with other grandmothers.

Colleen: Right. And that is so much of community, your community, your connection. And,

you know, I guess that leads me to the question of how has community kind of worked through this

time of your life? How is friendship? Is it important to you? Is your community smaller but better

or bigger? What works for you?

Karen Duffy:  Well, I was I’m lucky my best friend who I met when we were 14 and

we went we ran track together in high school. We went to college together. We lived together and we

got married within six months of each other and we live in the same building. So I have

very deep friendships with my sisters, my biological sisters, and the sisters that I count as

close, close friends. And there’s such a gift in Ecclesiastes 6.16.

It says, a good friend is the medicine of life. And women have such a gift in the art of

friendship. And there’s another quote I like that, you know, as iron sharpens iron,

like friends sharpen friends, we become better in the presence of people who support us,

who will kind of get us back on track. Or my mom has been…

a part of an organization. It’s a very informal group. It’s called club, but they don’t wrap

bandages.  Since 1962, they have met every other Tuesday.

And they play cards, they talk. And when, if someone got divorced,

all the girls would get together and throw a divorce shower. Or if somebody was widowed, well,

they’d be like, okay, you host club next time just to get you out of your nightgown.

And I just see my mom and  watching. her with her group of friends has inspired my sisters

and I to really value how I never take my friendships for granted.

I am just so deeply grateful. I mean, to go through life with the people that we’ve collected is

there’s no greater gift is there than having a good friend.

Bridgett: Absolutely.

Just the whole community, just like you said, it just brings something else to you, makes your life richer.

Karen Duffy: And it’s really important  with friends, is also to remind people like,

all right, did everyone get their mammograms? Because women kind of put things off and making

sure that, oh, I think because we’re always taking care of everyone else and making their,

their doctor’s appointments that we have, you get a reminder to care for

yourself. And that’s nice when you get that from somebody that you love.

Colleen: And also you listen to

your friend, you know, you do.

With the diagnosis of sarcoidosis, did that kind of force you to make your health a priority that

maybe it wasn’t before? Or have you always prioritized your own doctor’s appointments and your

health appointments?

Karen Duffy: Oh, no, sister. I lived my life the way you drive a rental car,

hitting the gas and taking a fast turn. No, I was only 30,

maybe 33 when I got sick. So I’ve spent half of my life as a catastrophically ill person.

I don’t really think of myself that way.

I didn’t really pay attention to the gift of lavish good health. And that was something living in

this body I kind of took for granted. I never imagined. I was actually at the Emmys with George Clooney and I was like, something’s going on. Are my hands numb?

And he’s like, well, I have that effect on women. And I was like, no, no, no. It feels like I got

struck by lightning. He’s like, exactly. I have that effect. And I really knew that something was grievously wrong. I was in LA. I flew back home to New York and my doctor very graciously stayed in

his office until I got there at about seven in the evening. And he said,

I don’t know what this is, but. It doesn’t look good. So he sent me to a neurologist,

but he said something which I really, every time I think about it, I write him a letter and thank

him. So I’m going to send Dr. Matarisa a note after we get off this. But he said, you know, this

is, you’re right at that age where it can be tricky. And,

you know, most catastrophic chronic illnesses happen between the ages of 20 and 40.

And he said, I just want you to be aware. control your life and do not like be bamboozled by

charlatans. And I thought that was such a, such a brave thing to say to somebody that you,

you know, didn’t know that well, but I think about that all the time. And I am so grateful that he

was looking out for me. And so it’s, it’s, it’s,

that was amazing. And having my whole life. Because, you know, I had this career.

I just did Dumb and Dumber and a bunch of movies. And it felt like with my career and my life that

I had built a airplane by hand. And I was just getting ready to take off.

And then I had to go back and put it in the hangar. And what’s interesting about fertility was I

kind of looked at my fertility as like, a motorcycle that I don’t know how to ride it yet,

but one day I’m going to get on that motorcycle and I’m going to figure out how to ride it.

And, uh, and going through chemo put me in menopause for the first time.

So I went through menopause three times. So that’s why I think you guys resound so much to me.

Colleen:  Okay, we’re going to need to hear this story. That’s not right. It’s hard enough to go through it

once. That’s unfair.

Bridgett: did you freeze your eggs before you did that?

Karen Duffy: The technology was not, this was in the later 90s.

And the technology was, they had to be fertilized. And,

uh, so again, I, I was having a hard enough time dating. So, uh, so I was on chemo for about six years and then,

I was put in what’s called a chemical menopause.

And then I was able to do fertility,

but I didn’t have my son until I was 40. Um, so, uh,

when you go through IVF, you get your body into,

 another menopause. Um, it was interesting because I’m on so much medicine, I had to use a surrogate. I call her my womb mate.

And it was funny because George was the one who told my husband about surrogacy

first and we met an amazing woman. And,

 what’s interesting is we had to sync our cycles together because she could not ovulate when we

were going to be in planning. So it was a really interesting experience. And then she was incredible.

We didn’t have success for a few years.

But eventually we were successful. And I remember being in the hospital,

I would send pictures to her of like me, like drinking a margarita. I’m like me in my ninth month.

And she drove herself to the hospital. We, we all met in the middle of the night.

 She had four children of her own and was done building her family.

And all of her kids were about five to six pounds. And out comes my son, who was 10

pounds. And she was like, I really should have looked at the size of your head before he agreed to

this. We had Dr. Doolittle, who was our obstetrician, but we had another

doctor come in, a pediatrician. And he helped deliver our son.

And he’s like, well, who do I give the baby to? I was like, well. You can give the baby to his

landlord. You know he’s had a nine month sublease and then she can introduce us to our

son. And this was in 2003. So the surrogacy was pretty much at its infancy.

And the doctor was like, that was so beautiful. What was that?

And I said, well, we’re the biological parents. And she was our gestational surrogate.

And he went in. She was in her hospital room with her four kids and we were with our Jack and he

 is like, that was the most beautiful birth I’ve ever seen.

You are amazing. And they fell madly in love and she wound up marrying the doctor.

The first time he was over, my son was coming out of the business end of the birth canal.

That was the first time they ever met.

Colleen: Oh, wow. That is an amazing story.

Bridgett: Oh, my gosh.

That’s an incredible story. That really is. Because, you know surrogacy has come so

far, you know, I mean, gosh, I can’t remember when it started, but it has come so far and is such

an option. I mean now you don’t even blink your eye when you hear that,

which is great for families and great for people. But what a gorgeous story that is.

Karen Duffy: I know. So our son was born in Maine. And the reason why we were matched with my woman is she has a very strong support system and she’s like, I don’t want to be anybody’s auntie.

Like I’ve got four kids, like I am doing this to help my children. And, and we’re like,

okay, well, we understand that boundary, but of course we’re fine with that

too. And now like, it’s now been 22 years and we talk all the time and, uh,

it’s, you know, so you never know. But also, I mean, I want to be honest because, um, It wasn’t

easy. There were many failures. And we often when we talk about,

you know, often we celebrate, you know, the final result.

But it took many years. And I want to be honest with that. It was and I would say I’ve been through

some challenging experiences in my life. And I would say infertility was truly one of the hardest.

And I’m barely, you know, stable, but it really, really,

really was difficult. And so I understand how tricky it is. And often,

you know, women, we didn’t, we kind of fib to them. What was interesting too, it was so early that

our son was born in Maine and he was, I believe the first or second, a child born via surrogacy

that I was not on his birth certificate. So I had to then do an adoption.

So he’s my biological child, but also my adoptive child, which, you know, so they’re like, there’s

always, there’s a lot of stuff that we don’t hear about. And that was kind of interesting.  It’s interesting that you couldn’t petition to have the name changed on the birth

certificate. Eventually, but it took months.

Bridgett: So has that changed?

Or do you know if that is still the case for people? Or I guess it depends on the state.

Karen Duffy: State by state. So in New York, New York State, where I live, when I was looking to do surrogacy in

the early 2000s, the only way you could do it was with a family member. So I was telling my mom,

I was like, come on, redhead, what are you doing?

But it could only be with a cousin or a sister. It had to be a family relation. And now it’s much

more. uh, open. Um, and you know, and,

 but I believe that there are so many ways to experience maternal motherhood.

Um, you know, you can be a mother to yourself or I have, I’m really involved with,

 children in foster care and I’ve been a big sister.

Gosh, when I first started working at MTV and started making money, I was like, gosh,

I should be paying tuition at some point. So I found an organization called Be a Student’s Friend.

And I met this young girl. She was… 12 years old, going ready to college. And I was like,

what is it you want to do? And she’s like, I want to be an occupational therapist because I live in

the hood and she’s Latina. And she said like, you know, a lot of physical therapists,

OTs, visiting nurses do not want to come to our neighborhood. And what I want to do is work in my

community. And so we met when she was 12. And now a few weeks ago,

 she got her doctorate at NYU and I got to walk down with her,

which was just such a gift. So that was that was extraordinary.

Colleen: That’s amazing.

Bridgett: That is. Oh, my gosh. When you can change lives by just being a part of them.

That’s that’s incredible.

Karen Duffy: It’s been such a joy. And I really like an organization

 called Foster Care to Success. And they’re looking a lot of kids who age out of the

foster care system. They they’re in college and they don’t get.

any you know any packages so I just did one with at the University of Colorado and Foster Care to Success looks for mentors and it’s great. It’s foster care with the number two (2)  to success and

they do a scarf drive so with any knitters, what they do is they collect red scarves and you send

them to foster care to success and then they create care packages, and they send them out on

Valentine’s Day. So that’s a nice way to kind of give back. And, you know, there’s,

there’s something like having a project where you’re engaged. And I think something handmade is

such a gift.

Bridgett: It is. And, you know, that’s a, another way that just enriches the,

you know, the things you can do with your life that’s going to enrich someone else. And my

daughter, she lives in Austin, Texas, she’s 30. And  she was just at the park with her

friends. And this young guy, wanted to start a flag football team. And she’s like,

okay. So she and her friends and some other friends got together, started this flag football team.

My husband and I went out there, saw one of their games. We found out the guy that started the

team, he’s 19 and he was a former foster kid. Oh, wow. And she said,

oh, mom, the other night,  his mentor was a former Cleveland Browns football player who played college at

UT Austin. And he’s his mentor came out, watched our game. So we’re having him join us for

Thanksgiving. Oh, that was, you know, my husband was like, Hey,

does he have anywhere to go? You know, could keep, we’re going to go out Thanksgiving, but just

little things. And I think I’ve heard you say this in the past about just little bitty things that

you do that can make a difference.

Karen Duffy:  Yes. Bridgett.  Like the fact that your daughter, you know, she said yes to life. There was an

opportunity and she was open. And that is such a gift. Yes. I mean, I think it was Mother Teresa

said, we all can’t do great things, but we can all do small things with great love.

And that can be showing up when you’d rather stay in on a rainy evening,

 or sending a letter or buying a gift card for a kid in foster care.

 We have a lot more to give and that is such a beautiful thing. Usually the

post office does Operation Santa where you can go to your post office and find a kid in need and

they write a letter to Santa and then you can send it to them so there’s so many ways to be useful and you just have to say yes That’s all it is. And it’s not a huge commitment,

but the benefits that I get from having these kids in my life!

 My husband was laughing at me because I signed up for this thing.

It’s called Be My Eyes. Okay. And it’s a website and it’s for people.

who are blind and um and then when they you sign up and then um while a person will then call you

and they’re like um which one’s the powdered sugar and which one’s the rat poison and like no well

That was the example. It’s like, which is the red sweater,

which is the striped sweater? I think that’s probably more, but I was hamming it up to my husband.

But just something little, just signing up. Yes, it’s called Be My Eyes.

And it’s kind of cool. And it’s just a fun little thing that… know,

somebody will call and maybe you’ll have a conversation and, you know, you just feeling there’s

nothing better than feeling like you’re useful.

Colleen: Right. So true. Especially as we get older,

a lot of people feel invisible and without a purpose. So things like that are great ways.

For them to feel like a part of the world. And I was going to ask you what you’re looking forward

to and what’s keeping you busy. But apparently, there’s a lot of things. Keeping you busy.

But what are you looking forward to? What’s coming up for you in the near future?

Karen Duffy: Well, it’s funny.

I spoke to President Biden when he was Vice President Biden.

And we were talking about purpose. And he said that finding your purpose is having something to

Love, something to do and something to look forward to. And I think as we shift to these,

as we matriculate through life, our purpose changes. So I am over the moon.

I have a new book that I’m working on, which will probably be out in a year. And I love writing.

And that’s something I’m really looking forward to.

I took a course for the Office of Emergency Management.

And again, I thought because I am disabled that, oh, could I be useful?

But through the Office of Emergency Management, they have something in most every community called the Community Emergency

Response Team. And what’s beautiful, they’re like, no, we have room for everyone on our team.

So whatever you can do, like, so it’s supporting first responders. So if there’s a fire,

you’re there directing traffic or getting coffee. And it just feels there’s nothing better than

feeling like you are being used for a purpose and that your life has direction. And I think in this

decade where there’s a lot of changes, it’s quite nice to be able to shift.  Because my son doesn’t need me as much and he’ll be fully fledged. And there’s just such a joy to it and finding

new ways to be useful and to serve.

Colleen:  We love that. Will you come back when the book launches?

Because we want to hear all about it.

Karen Duffy: Are you not kidding? You’re going to have to hire security to

keep me away from you guys. Never. That would be so exciting. I would absolutely love it.

I would love it. Thank you very much. I’ve so enjoyed my time with you today.

Colleen: We have too.

And we’ve learned so much, so many places to volunteer and just, you know, be useful.

So thank you so much. Oh, well, it was so great to see you.